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Zenzirouj
PostPosted: Wed May 28, 2003 12:35 pm  Reply with quote

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I'm confused...
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nightbeest77
PostPosted: Wed May 28, 2003 12:38 pm  Reply with quote

then my job here is done. my question is how can one decide what is and what is not enlightened, because everything is open to personal interpretation, like with the matrix. cypher wanted it more than the real world, and everyone else wanted the real world over the matrix.

my second question is, what if the matrix and the real world are both enlightened places for humans, because in a sense both places free the human from their traditional mind. its interesting to think about how maybe the machines made themselves "unenlightened" while making humanity "enlightened" wherever they are.
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Cam
PostPosted: Thu May 29, 2003 12:52 pm  Reply with quote

Can I ask how are we defining enlightenment.
The buddhist view is the point where you transcend the realm of phenomena by breaking your karmic cycle. This state of awareness is also called Nirvana.
Until you have reached this state of being, a person is not considered to be enlightened, but simply on the path to enlightenment.

If you are christian this definition doesn't hold water in your belief set.
Because a result of karma is reincarnation, the cyclic pattern of death and rebirth. This cycle continues until you have completely let go of the physical realm. The illusion. You can be aware of the illusion and still not be enlightened. Cypher still had mental attachments to the Matrix, his mind was definitely not totally free. Actually none of the main characters have reached a state of enlightenment. Even Neo, albeit he's the closest.
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Cam
PostPosted: Thu May 29, 2003 1:01 pm  Reply with quote

When enlightenment is reached some CHOOSE to return to help
other sentient beings along their path to enlightment. This is where the idea of going back into the Matrix to try and free minds comes from.
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nightbeest77
PostPosted: Fri May 30, 2003 12:58 pm  Reply with quote

enlightenment, like all other things, its based on personal interpretation, or the one who is attempting to aid you in becoming enlightened. when you feel that you are ready, you will be, and when you know you are ready, you will be, or at least thats how it seems to be done.
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Yudhistira
PostPosted: Fri Jun 20, 2003 8:00 am  Reply with quote

The way out of the matrix... the way to the truth is the cessation of all thought. If you can leave your thoughts behind you, then the truth will find you.

This is "nirvana", a place that is not a place... it is both existence and nonexistence, time and timelessness, beginning and end... it transcends all things.

But even desiring to attain nirvana is still a desire. The truth is that there is no reality, neither here nor there. Reality is a myth... and it is as real or unreal as you believe it to be... as relevant or irrelevant as you believe it to be.

Free your mind.
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brooklyn
PostPosted: Mon Jun 30, 2003 5:09 am  Reply with quote

When speeking to each other we say whatever it is we think the other wants to hear, so my only answer is your truth and you shall tell me mine.
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